Babbles Nonsense
Welcome to my verbal diary where I want to discuss any and all things that is essentially on my mind or have wondered about. Sometimes I will be solo and then other times I will have some amazing guests to bring all different perspectives in life. The ultimate goal is to hopefully bring some joy, laughter, inspiration, education, and just maybe a little bit of entertainment. Don't forget to like, rate, and share the podcast with a friend!
Babbles Nonsense
TBT: The Emotional Landscape of Birth: A Doula's Perspective w/ Tracy (Rocket City Doulas)
TBT: Tracy from Rocket City Doulas shatters common misconceptions about birth support professionals with her refreshingly honest perspective. "A doula is like a wedding planner, but for birth," she explains, drawing a perfect analogy for those unfamiliar with the role. Far from being exclusive to unmedicated or home births, doulas primarily focus on emotional wellness while medical providers handle physical concerns – creating a complementary approach to comprehensive birth support.
Drawing from her personal experience with a traumatic cesarean birth, Tracy shares how feeling voiceless during her delivery shaped her mission to ensure no birthing person feels similarly powerless. The trauma wasn't about the delivery method, but rather the emotions surrounding it and how communication broke down. This profound experience fuels her dedication to filling critical gaps in the birth support system, acting as a translator between medical staff and families, and helping clients understand their options without judgment.
What makes Rocket City Doulas distinct is their commitment to supporting all birth choices equally. With 90% of their births taking place in hospitals and 60% of clients planning epidurals, they've positioned themselves as mainstream doulas who serve families across a spectrum of birth preferences. Their team approach pairs two doulas with each client, ensuring continuous on-call support from contract signing through postpartum recovery. Beyond labor, their postpartum services include overnight baby care, breastfeeding assistance, and crucial emotional support for new parents navigating sleep deprivation and identity shifts.
Whether you're planning an unmedicated birth, scheduled cesarean, or anything in between, connecting with Tracy's team provides access to evidence-based information, emotional guidance, and physical support tailored to your unique needs. Visit rocketcitydoulas.com to explore how professional birth support can transform your transition to parenthood.
Find Tracy and her team here:
https://www.instagram.com/rocketcitydoulas/
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What is up everyone?
Johnna:Welcome back to an episode that's going to be another throwback Tuesday. I had every intention of sitting down. It's Monday. This comes out on Tuesday. I'm recording an episode today. It was going to be about ghosting in the dating world, but I woke up not feeling so great. So I'm like you know, I just don't feel that great. I want to just sit down and relax for the evening. So I'm going to do a take me back Tuesday, throwback Tuesday, whatever you want to say for this episode, and I will be putting that episode out, I'm hoping next week, hopefully. Whatever this Sonnys stuff is, it's just going to go away. I should have recorded yesterday. Something in me told me I should have recorded yesterday, but I was like, ah, it'll be fine, I can do it Monday after work. No, but anyways, I'm going to replay if you have not listened to or if this is your first time listening to it. I'm going to play the episode with Tracy from Rocket City, doulas, who is a midwife, and I was just inspired to play this because I do have a lot of friends that are about to be second time mommies, and then I have some friends that are going to be first time moms. So I just wanted to play this, maybe for them and inspiration, and hopefully I will be back next week with a new episode. So here you go, guys. What is up everyone?
Johnna:Welcome back to another episode of the babbles nonsense podcast. On today's episode we have tracy, who is the owner and founder of rocket city doulas here in huntsville, alabama. She is also a doula herself and this podcast was a very informative podcast even for me, even though I'm in healthcare. I do not know much about the mother-baby side of things, as y'all all know and have listened to on previous episodes, but I actually really enjoyed interviewing her Number one. She's easy to talk to. It was also just very informative on things that I didn't know, even being in healthcare. So I really think you're going to love this episode, even if you're not wanting to conceive or you haven't conceived, this is so much information that I think we need to put out into the world. So give it a listen and go follow Tracy at Rocket City Duelist. All right, guys, welcome back to another episode. I I have Tracy from Rocket City Doulas here with me today. Hello, tracy. So we were talking just a little bit before the podcast and my friends know that I'm not wanting to be a mother.
Tracy:Sure.
Johnna:And so I'm really illiterate when it comes to anything, baby. So I actually have a lot of questions myself. Sure, you would think that I would know because I'm in healthcare care, but it really is a specialty. It is, yeah, like you have to specialize in it. So I did acute care for the simple fact that I did not have to do pregnancy nor children. It's fair, yeah. So I want to ask, like the obvious question what is a doula? Yeah, um.
Tracy:so for people who really have no grasp of what a doula is, a lot of times, I'll start by just talking about, like, do you know what a wedding planner is? Yes, okay, you have a good grasp on what a wedding planner is, so I kind of equate it to a wedding planner. But for birth. So it's your ideas, your vision, your kind of goals, right, like all of that. And the doula is, um, coming alongside of you and helping you figure out. Does that venue allow you to do what you're hoping for, or is that something that specialize in, or is that something that you're going to have to maybe travel for or go somewhere else? You know, is this vision you have for your birth and postpartum realistic with what you've already chosen, along like with getting you in contact with you know, I'm putting this in quotations of vendors, right?
Johnna:Right.
Tracy:People you need to have connections with, like an IBCLC, which would be like a lactation somebody who specializes in lactation and breastfeeding. We have a lot of different connections and networks that we can help get people into the right spot for what their needs are and what they're looking for. Um, but it's all their plan, their day, right, and we're just kind of that person that comes alongside and tries to make it go as smooth as possible.
Johnna:I like that definition because I I initially thought, like from just what I've seen on TV, instagram, whatever that a doula was just specifically like oh, let's just do your birth plan.
Tracy:That's it.
Johnna:Yeah, so I didn't realize like you did like the whole navigating and everything.
Tracy:So that's really good to know. Yeah, I mean like, if we're talking goals, like our main goal is to reduce anxiety and instill confidence, and you can kind of do that throughout, like anything we do is really with the ultimate goal of those two things, um, but it's definitely a lot of information. People don't? I feel like a lot of people think it's only for unmedicated birth. They might use the term natural. We don't use the term natural. We personally use the term unmedicated. All birth is natural.
Johnna:Like a home right, like a home birth, like that's what you kind of be equated to, like you're going to go to their house and you're going to, you're going to birth the baby, right, and you're the doctor, you're the nurse, you're everything is kind of what you do equate it to.
Tracy:Yeah, so we're in, we're, I mean honestly, our, our doulas are 90 percent births in the hospital. That's who we support. Oh, ok, we kind of niche and mainstream. So I'd say about 60 percent of our clients plan on getting a epidural. So it's really not what you think of when you picture, like you know, traditional doula, um, and and there's. There's a lot of reasons for that. One is because that is something that is super important to me there are a lot of doulas for the unmedicated community and and people who kind of lean that way, um, and that's great, right, there is a large population of doulas like that who service that community. But for us there are not very many doulas who service the mainstream community, the people who are looking to give birth, let's say, by cesarean, like a planned cesarean.
Tracy:That's something that we support, and we happily support. It's not just like, oh, I'm so sorry, your birth, you know plan turned to a cesarean. It's more like hey, you know you're wanting that, let's talk about that, um, and make sure that you have your you know your desires listened to and things like that, versus kind of going in with the mindset that that's second best and I love that and we're going to get cause that's one of the questions I have for you.
Johnna:But before we get there, I kind of want to know, like, how did you get into this practice? Like, were you always just like? I love children and I'll you know? I love to hear that.
Tracy:Yes and no. So I knew I always wanted to be a mom Like that was. I feel like I. Your story is so valid to me, um, because I did always know I wanted to be a mom from an early age. Um, I will say I didn't know exactly what a mom really meant. To be a mom Like I, I feel like you know. My reality was a little different than my expectations which I feel like is pretty common. Um, but I actually went into education.
Tracy:My degree's in ed um uh, with a degree in K through eight with math and math and science minors.
Johnna:Well, I mean you. Then you wanted to be around children like you.
Tracy:So originally I got to my senior year, my last semester, so student teaching and I was like I hate this.
Johnna:So then you were like I want to. So you were like I don't want to teach anymore, or you weren't, so you were teaching.
Tracy:Yeah, and then you were like I don't want to do this anymore. Like I basically got to my very so my very last semester of my degree was student teaching. So I was full-time in the classroom, running the classroom. Prior to that I had a hundred hours of classroom time, but most of it was like um assistant, like classroom assistant or teacher's aid, that type of thing where you're like helping kids. I loved being around kids, um, but it really was different when you're the one leading the classroom.
Tracy:There is a lot of behind the scenes stuff. I felt like a lot of what I had prepared for was never going to be put into practice, Like I spent two entire semesters learning how to build curriculum that you will never ever, ever, ever use because the public school hands you curriculum right Like so there's a lot of stuff that I didn't really know the reality of until I got into my student teaching and I was like I really don't like this, it's not, I didn't not like the kids, it was more so.
Johnna:I didn't really like the system, like that's really related. Because, like, I mean the same, like with me. When I became into nursing, like I initially was like I want to be a nurse because I want to help people. But then when you get into the practice and you're like, oh, you mean there's the government's involved and all this other stuff is involved, then you're like, no, it's not what I got myself into. So how did you make that transition from I don't want to do this anymore to now I want to be a doula?
Tracy:So we moved. So we both grew up in. My husband and I grew up in Michigan. So we got married in college and graduated and then moved immediately here and so we started having kids right away. I was 22 when I had my oldest and she's a she's actually a freshman at UAB studying nursing.
Johnna:Oh yeah, you are very young.
Tracy:Yes, good to have a college student, and then our next one is a senior in high school.
Johnna:So he'll be going to college as well. Wow, yeah, we did start young.
Tracy:Our younger two are a little bit further apart, because we had a lot of loss. We had six miscarriages, so our younger two are a little bit younger. They're um 13 and 12. Um, so we've got a little bit of an age gap. But kind of going back, um we moved here. I didn't know anybody, um I we knew one person at my husband's work and I was a nanny and so I really didn't for someone um a child who had special needs, so we didn't really go out of the house. I didn't really know a lot of people. I didn didn't meet a lot of people. I didn't have a community or a network, and this was like pre internet on our phone days. Like this is um, we were so broke that we had to go to the library for internet, like to check my email and stuff. Like we did not have home internet, um, and so like I didn't even really have that community. You know what?
Johnna:I mean, like I didn't even really have that. You know what I mean.
Tracy:Like I didn't really have that right. Yeah, and so, um, I had my first baby and it was pretty traumatic, um, and I always kind of pause here and say the trauma was not the actual mode of delivery or the method of delivery. Yes, she was a cesarean, but that's not what made it traumatic. What made it traumatic was the way I felt, the emotions behind it.
Tracy:And, honestly, how other people made me feel. I felt very much like I didn't have a voice and things are happening to me. Even if I had had a voice, I would have chosen the same exact thing, but I was never given the opportunity. I would have chosen the same exact thing, but I was never given the opportunity, and so I felt very powerless and alone and scared. And so what kind of even started me on the journey to become a doula was really that birth experience. I walked away going there's got to be a better way. Like there has to be somebody kind of in between. Like the nurses are busy, they have a job, you know, there's gotta be someone who can just be with the person giving birth, that knows birth. That isn't, um. The other thing with like spouses and things is there's emotional entanglement, right.
Tracy:We don't always make the best choices for people we love in those types of situations, and so you know. Yes, my husband was very supportive, but it's different than when you have somebody else that isn't emotionally entangled as an advocate.
Johnna:Yeah, so someone could advocate for you. That could actually like, let's say, things go awry. They can sit there and tell the doctor stop, this is not what she wants. Because you're obviously in pain, you're in labor, you're emotional, you you may be saying no, but then the doctor's looking at you like, yeah, but that's just coming out of emotion.
Tracy:And I never would have said no, that's a thing Like my thing would have been more like I just want to know what's happening to me. I just want someone to stop and explain things to me and say guess or no um, I never would have chose differently.
Johnna:I never would have not had that cesarean or done it's more than comfort, would you say, like just comforting, to know that someone is like there and you're. You actually understand what they're about to do to your body yes.
Tracy:Well, I mean to me just having the idea that I could say now yes, right, I never would but like, but it's almost presented to you as if you could not right, Right oh absolutely.
Tracy:That was kind of the thing, like it was just presented as like this is what we're doing, yeah, and, like I said, I still I am the type of person that would have just said, especially when I was younger I'm not as much now, not as much now, but when I was younger would definitely have just said, okay, let's do that. But I never was given the opportunity to have the space to say hey, yes, okay, let's do that. Um, and and thankfully I will pause and say that a lot of our newer providers, like our younger providers in our area, are really good at giving that space. Things have really changed, um for the better, and a lot of our new group of doctors that are coming up.
Tracy:Um, but you know it is what it is back then, um, and it wasn't just like the provider either. There was some other situations. I kind of had somebody, I think, on the nursing side, that maybe was having a bad day and was a little older and kind of a little bit more callous.
Tracy:I will say I'm not going to hesitate to say like she was she was pretty grumpy, um, and so I also felt like my when I did voice things that they weren't listened to and really weren't, like you know, explained again. Um, I had a pretty bad reaction to the anesthesia and was in recovery for about six hours after the birth of my baby. And that's not. That's not normal.
Tracy:Um and so you know, and my baby also had to go to the NICU and no one would tell me why. And I just felt really helpless again of that, like I'm not asking someone to fix it, I'm just asking someone to tell me, like what, why is my body, body doing this? And then also, why is my baby in the NICU? Um, again, not that they had to tell me perfectly, but like yeah, your baby's okay, like let me call up there or whatever. Right, like it doesn't take a lot of time.
Johnna:I would say like I'm not a mom, but like I know, like a lot of my friends are moms, and like you, don't mess with their children.
Tracy:Yeah, you just don't.
Johnna:That's when, mama bear comes out, so you don't mess with their children. Yeah, you just don't. That's when mama bear comes out, so you don't mess with their children. So I would assume, like, obviously that's causing you a lot of anxiety because and I mean, I've had friends where, like you know, that happens they take them from them and they're like can someone please tell me what's going on? Yes, and so I, I get that.
Tracy:Yeah and so, like, um, like I said, I kind of walked away from this where it's just going hey, there, there's got be a better way. Like there, there has to be someone that fills in that gap. Cause I think to the thing that I have learned over the years um, I have a lot of good friends that are nurses that I met when I early on in my doula career, and I know how busy they are and I also know how much they want to be doing what we're doing on the doula side. Um, they want to be in that.
Tracy:like you said, that's why they got into it was to kind of be the person that we're being on on our side, Um, but I also know they have a lot of work that they have to do, and so there was never for me when I went into it it was never the expectation that I was going to fix birth or solve birth or kind of like avenge birth Right.
Tracy:It was more so like wanting to fill a gap that I knew existed, from my own experience of having someone who could just be with people, who was knowledgeable, who could fill in those gaps. I say sometimes like a translator between nurse and patient or doctor and patient, right of like hey, here's what's happening.
Johnna:Even if I can't, I'm not giving medical advice, I'm just saying, hey, this is what is likely going to happen, or, like you know, just kind of preparing, yeah, and like, coming from the nursing side, like, like I said when I got into nursing, you think it's going to be like what you do, like hold the hand, advocate for the patient, like listen to them, but then you quickly realize it's hey, you got 20 patients and you need to see all of them in the next 10 minutes and you need to also do all your charting and we're not paying you over time and so and I think people forget that side of nursing and they forget they're like well, why is it? Nursing should be compassionate and they should be caring. Yes, we absolutely should, but you should also talk to your administrators about how overworked they are and how many patients they have not to take away from this.
Tracy:No, no, no, no and that's exactly what I realized too, like right, like that is. Even in my first birth I realized they're really busy. They're not the reason, which is sad. Yeah, and in part of it was I was falling through the gap right, like it was me, it does um and it wasn't intentional of anybody that was taking care of me.
Tracy:It just was a product of the system, and so, for me that's sort of why I got into it was just to be that person that could sort of fill in that gap space. That again isn't giving medical advice, it's just, you know, being that person that says they are suggesting blah, blah, blah to you. Um, how do you feel about that option? Or here are the benefits and risks. You know what feels best for you in this moment. Do you have any questions that you'd like to ask your provider about? Um, one thing we do, too, is help people come up with how to ask questions, because they don't always know how to formulate questions. Medical ease is a whole language in and of itself.
Johnna:It is.
Tracy:Which is I always kind of. I mean, I don't forget with clients, but I forget, like when I go to my own appointments and I speak. I had a specialist appointment at Vanderbilt with a sleep neurologist and afterwards he goes Do you work in healthcare? And I was like, well, sort of like it's adjacent, and I told him and he was like, okay, I could tell like by some of the language you use right, Because it is its own language.
Johnna:Well, you forget. Like you know, we abbreviate things, so I'll be texting a friend and I'll completely forget like an abbreviation for like antibiotics or something. I'm like you need this antibiotic and I'll just do ABX and they'll go what's ABX? And I'm like, oh yeah, it's antibiotics.
Johnna:And that like you just quickly forget. But also like that makes sense, because, like, even when I was in nursing, before I became a nurse practitioner, I would walk into a room right after a doctor left and the patient would literally be looking at me like what, what did?
Johnna:they say and it was a trend like I would have to be, like, well, to put in layman's terms, this is what he just said to you. And they would even be like, thank you so much for explaining. And then they would say the doctor didn't explain anything to me. And I was like, well, they did, but they're not thinking about explaining it to you the way you could understand, which you know. So it is there. There do need to be translators, and that's why I think there's different positions for everything in healthcare. So I think that is wonderful that you are doing that, and I love the way that you explain that to me because, like you said, like I didn't think about it like that, I thought about it like what you see on TV.
Tracy:Oh, yeah, yeah, and I think most people do, like I think that's something I've been trying to change, even for a long time in our community, specifically of, like you know, our physical support even isn't just for people planning an unmedicated labor. It's also like once you have an epidural and we're helping you change positions, like right, like or after a C-section and we're helping you feed your baby.
Johnna:Yeah.
Tracy:Like there's a lot when we talk even about most people picture physical support during an unmedicated labor when they think about a doula.
Johnna:So while we're talking about it, let's just go ahead and get into that Cause. That's something I wanted to know is like what all encompasses? So you just said, because what you think about is natural birth, so like home birth, so do you?
Tracy:do home birth, so we do attend as long as there is a certified nurse, midwife.
Johnna:Okay, and that's. That was another question.
Tracy:I'm sorry, certified professional midwife at home, cause I was going to ask what the difference actually was in the doula and a midwife. Yeah, so we kind of say like just a very simplistic. So like I hope people don't take this the wrong way it's just very, very simplistic. So like I hope people don't take this the wrong way, it's just very, very simplistic. Um, uh, a midwife or an obstetrician are responsible for the physical wellness of the mom and baby, right, um, and we are more focusing on the emotional wellness.
Johnna:Okay, I like that, I like that.
Tracy:Um, and that's kind of our goal, right, so we're not doing like anything medical.
Johnna:I mean so you're not so if you were at home doing a home birth?
Tracy:like you're not delivering the baby. No, no, no, no, no, I really hope not. So have I caught babies? Yes, was I terrified? Absolutely.
Johnna:So you are doing the emotional support to the, to the pregnant lady giving birth, and then so you do. You can do home births if there's someone there that helps deliver, and you also have mentioned that you do hospital births, where you do medicated births. Yep, so when you're doing your medicated births you said that you help them do position changes what else are you helping with them with, if it is a?
Tracy:medicated birth, um, so there's always a period of time, too, before you get medication right. So, um, and that can vary depending on, like, how far along you are or how full the hospital is or how busy the anesthesiologist is. So, um, usually there's a good amount still that we're doing in terms of pain management before someone gets an epidural um.
Tracy:But also, you know, honestly, it's not just, it's yes positioning. You know it really depends on the person in front of us. Sometimes we're working through emotions, sometimes we're talking about things, sometimes it's that informational support that we already talked about in terms of like translating or what go walking through the process of what we call the brain process, which is benefits, risks, alternatives, what's your intuition, say, and what happens if you do nothing? Um and so kind of walking through that process, um with someone when they're faced with a decision or a choice, um to help them come to a conclusion that feels right for their family. Um, that's really heavy in that informational support. It's still emotional support, right, but it's really heavy informational support For people who have had maybe traumatic birth before or even like a cesarean, and they're maybe trying for a vaginal birth after cesarean. A lot of it is going to be emotional, it's going to be working through feeling, big feelings, often that type of thing. Sometimes it's support of the partner, not sometimes.
Johnna:Sometimes it's support of the partner, not sometimes, it's always support of the partner almost every birth I've ever been to in my life um really supporting the partner through those same things.
Tracy:Um, obviously not position changes, but on the physical side we're often like encouraging them to take care of themselves, like get something to eat, get something to drink, and they can do that because they know that someone is there with their person, and they can go ahead and step away for a few minutes to take care of their bodies as well, so that they don't get sick or don't you know?
Tracy:they can be the best version of themselves too, um, and so that's a huge part of what we do. We say that, you know, the person giving birth is our primary client, but the entire family unit is our client, so we're also making sure that we're supporting that partner as well as we can. Do you do anything post birth, like do you help with breastfeeding? Yeah, um, so, depending, like we always ask, cause one of our, one of our big company tenants is, um, unbiased and nonjudgmental support. So what we typically ask a client is how are you planning to feed your baby? Um, and we use that verbiage on purpose.
Johnna:Well, it's so controversial because you have people in the streets being like, if you don't breastfeed your baby, you know it's gonna be like horrible, but then some people, like my mother, could not breastfeed me.
Tracy:I turned out okay and I mean, honestly, I think people are very short-sighted in pushing yeah and this is coming. I breastfed a combination of my kids for like, I think it was like 10 years. So, like, personally, yeah, it's very important to me, but I also understand the nuance and like there are people who really it's not even just can't like yeah, my mom could not like she could, she didn't even, I think.
Johnna:I think she was telling me like she couldn't even produce milk at all. Yes, like she tried and there are.
Tracy:there are those folks who want to breastfeed but can't, but, but there is also a group of people who don't want to, and there's also a group of people that have some trauma that it would be worse for their mental health to even attempt. And then I would even say there's another group of people that are on medications and maybe have to consider what either mental health or their physical health would look like without those medications while they breastfeed.
Tracy:Yeah, or their physical health would look like without those medications while they breastfeed? Yeah, um, and it I. As a caveat, if you want to breastfeed and you're on medications, always check with you know someone who's knowledgeable to make sure that you truly can't breastfeed on those medicines.
Tracy:But we have had clients in the past who they really need to go back on some medications in order to be the best version of themselves and they can't breastfeed. So, um, that is part of the reason that we lead with that question of how, how are you planning to feed your baby? Versus are you planning to breastfeed, right? Um, and so, yes, if, if a family is planning to breastfeed, we will absolutely help them, um, particularly while we're in the hospital to get a good latch before we leave. But we also come back, um, with our labor services. We come back within the first two weeks to kind of sit down and do a check-in. We, we joke and say how's your brain and how's your?
Johnna:body. Yeah, well, because I mean the postpartum depression. I'm sure it's been around for forever, but it's just now becoming a mainstream thing to talk about. So I would assume, like that would be that post checkup, to be like yes gauging where they are in that and we used to like when I first began.
Tracy:So I became a doula in late like early, I don't say late 2000s, oh, a, oh, nine, yeah. And so I've been doing it a long time. I did solo work for 11 years before I opened the agency and early on I was kind of taught that what you do when you go to a postpartum checkup is like you ask about the baby and feeding and things, and my mindset kind of shifted and now we ask about the mom, like how are you sleeping, when you can, how are you eating, how are you taking care of your body, like, are you you doing?
Tracy:okay, and they can text us with questions about their baby or we can talk about those things in this appointment too, but that's not our main goal. Our main goal is their kind of physical and mental recovery from birth, and we also have postpartum services, which are a completely not completely different service, but it's a different package, right, and we come anywhere from four hours during the day for a few days a week to. We have, you know, folks that we worked with every day from nine to six, okay, and then we have some families that we do overnights with, so we also do overnight support, so that's anything from. If they are breastfeeding, oftentimes we'll bring the baby to them and kind of do everything else, because there's a lot of else that takes a lot of time and away from sleep right so, like, even if a family's breastfeeding, we'll bring the baby to them, they'll breastfeed and then we'll take the baby back, change, burp, get the baby back to sleep.
Tracy:So we're kind of doing all of that.
Johnna:I love that, like if I was gonna have a baby. This sounds like an amazing service if I could.
Tracy:I mean, we didn't have enough money, but when I you know like maybe in my later years, um, my, my last two kids, my last one didn't sleep for over two years, so like I would have paid anything I think, for for some overnight support, right, um, but yeah, so like. And then families who are formula feeding often we just do it all and they sleep when we're there and it's I don't think people forget how sleep is, especially trying to be a mom, you know and do everything.
Johnna:We're a person, yeah, without sleep, yes, um, so what? So, since you do kind of all the things like how, when do you first start working with the mom? Do you start like like if I found out today that I was pregnant again, this was mentioned on a podcast coming out like if I found out today that I was pregnant again. This was mentioned on a podcast coming out. Nobody start the rumor that I'm pregnant, because I'm not, but I'm just using me as an example, like I'm not pregnant. But if I were and I came to you, would you like, would you start working with me immediately?
Tracy:yeah, okay, yeah, um, it just depends. So again, it's going to be you need to teach family. Um, we I have a phone call next week with someone who is not pregnant and they're trying to conceive and they want to get all their ducks in a row so that when they do get pregnant they know exactly who they're going to hire and all of those things For our labor support. We actually go on call for families as soon as they sign a contract. So whenever they sign a contract and get payment and we are theirs meaning. So we work in doula teams of two on labor. So each of our clients has a doula team of two and they share call. So they're each on call 15 days of the month. Every single day someone is on call Wow, wow.
Tracy:So if you have an emergency or if you deliver your baby early, then that's really the thing of it.
Johnna:That's what I was going to ask you, like what happens if someone does deliver? Early or they deliver before you get there, right.
Tracy:So, like, if they deliver early, we have somebody on call. Traditionally, most doulas don't go on call till 38 weeks, 37 weeks maybe. Okay, our doulas go on call as soon as someone hires us and we've had people call us for support with a kidney stone. Right, like, I need somebody to go with me to the hospital for this kidney stone or whatever. Maybe they don't know it's a kidney stone, but it's not just labor support.
Tracy:They have access to their doulas 24 seven for emergency support, and then they also have phone, email, text support throughout their pregnancy. So ideally someone would hire us early so that they would have the most use of that support, right.
Johnna:I mean right.
Johnna:You would get the most bang for your buck if you hire us early and I assume you sit down and you talk about the birth plan, but you obviously know, like because me being illiterate about birth, I would come to you and be like I don't know what I want, I don't know what to do.
Johnna:But then you would sit down and kind of explain everything, because I know and I'm not saying just in our community I know it's more of a push for cesareans from the doctor side, just because it's easier, they don't have to be on it, and I'm not saying this about any one individual, I've heard this just because it's easier for the doctor to kind of know.
Johnna:And it's more of a hey, you want your doctor to deliver your baby, right? Because you know you never know when you're going to go into labor. And now that doctors aren't on call all the time like they used to be back in the day, yeah, so I would assume you would sit down that I guess that's a good example. So let's say I come to you and I'm like I do not want a cesarean unless it's an emergency, and then we're in birth, like in the hospital, and then they try to like say, hey, we can just get this done if it's a cesarean, that's when you would step in so it depends, like, honestly, the way that we typically step in would be to say, hey, so they are offering you a cesarean and they are offering it for XYZ.
Tracy:Okay, what are your questions?
Tracy:That's usually what we start with, because clarifying is most important honestly when we're kind of facing a decision is to understand the bigger picture of what's going on, because sometimes I've found people will providers will offer it kind of gently in the beginning because they do think it's coming eventually to be a medically necessary. It's important for the birthing person, like the person giving birth, to know is this going to be an emergency or is it really just like a do you want to be done kind of thing, because that may affect their decision right, that's a good point, because if someone came to me and said, hey, they're saying this will be medical, medically necessary, I would probably go oh, then let's do it now, before it turns into an emergency, right?
Johnna:so that's a good way that you could.
Tracy:Oh, yeah, I love that so kind of just clarifying, like asking questions, digging a little deeper, um, and then sitting with the client and saying, okay, even if it is, I mean, I'm going to be flat out honest. There are times when, you know, I think, when someone comes to us with a birth plan, this isn't an ideal, this is an ideal picture of what we're hoping for, right, part of what we do, too, is to really dig deep into motivation on our end. Your birth plan is a 10,000 foot view for your medical providers. Um, the birth plan really isn't for the doulas right Like it's, it's for you and your medical provider.
Tracy:Our job is to dig deeper and understand motivation of why these things are on your birth plan. Why is this important to you? So that if the plans change in, the poop hits a fan like how can we still support what your deepest goals and motivations are at the heart of it? So that if you do have a cesarean, you still can walk away with, hopefully, a positive birth experience. And so part of the way that we come at things like, let's say, the situation with your offer to cesarean, is to walk through again, kind of clarify what's going on, but walk through like you know how are you feeling about this, because someone may be completely at the end of their rope and they may have said previously they don't want a cesarean, but they've been in labor for 52 hours, right, and they may now be ready for a cesarean.
Tracy:And so we never say you're not getting a cesarean right, like what instead we say is hey, previously we've talked a lot about how you really didn't want to have a C-section. Do you want to ask for more time? Do you want to ask to see if we can? Um, you know, if they don't have an epidural yet, like, sometimes an epidural is a choice to give some rest and, you know, maybe make some change. Um, we kind of walk through, like what the options are and then, and then we say what feels best to you. Um, because even though we write that thing on a piece of paper in the moment, we may have changed our minds, and so we'll remind you of what you wrote on the paper, right?
Johnna:well, I mean and that's something I guess, uh, other people might be scared of is like here's my birth plan. Like, are you gonna judge me? Are you going? Like what if I change my mind halfway through? Are you gonna? Is my doula gonna judge me? Is she gonna care? Like maybe that's some hesitation there as well? Yeah, and we're not.
Tracy:Yeah, okay, they're not. Might be there are some people out there that probably would. Um, and that's why it's important to kind of know, um, some people want a doula who won't let them change their mind. Um, we kind of tend to be the people that I don't want to be coercive in any type of way and I don't want to be the reason that someone has negative feelings about their birth. And if and you're an adult, so if I come to you and I say, hey, remember we talked about this and you said that you were hoping not to do this. How do you feel about this now? And you tell me you still want to do that thing, then I'm going to honor you and what you've said, because now you, as an adult, are telling me something right like I'm not going to be like no, you don't you don't want that.
Johnna:No, I love that you say that because, like I like, again, this is all just from movies. You see it from movies, where people like it's a push kind of thing, yeah. So I think there are hesitations when it comes to that because they're like, well, I don't want to be judged if you know, I get in there and it's too painful or, you know, this is too long, or now I wanted a natural birth or an unmedicated birth. Now I want a medicated birth. Like, yeah, you know, because people say things like I've had friends that are like, yeah, I want an unmedicated birth, and they get in there like, nope, give me the drugs. Yeah, no, no, no.
Tracy:I completely identify with that. So, no, no, no. And I think you know again, when you go in with the like, at the core of our beliefs, of our agency is non-biased, non-judgmental Like, and so that's so very important to me as an individual that we provide that. That, um, we, you know, if that ever was to happen, that would be a huge hit to me, like a huge. I would be so devastated. Um, our goal is to make sure that you feel supported, no matter what you choose, even if that changes in birth and it's not that we're not going to remind you because obviously, if you're writing it in your birth plan, it's important to you and we want to make sure that you're going to feel good about this decision later.
Tracy:Because, when emotions are hitting the fan, right Right, you'll make any decision. And also, I also want to remind people that they what we do, what we call make space. So I want to remind them that they actually most of the time have time to think about what they're being like offered. So, you know, one of the best things you can do is just say, hey, can we have a minute to talk about this, or is this an emergency? Because if we have a minute, then again most people feel better about the decision they're making when they have a few minutes to process and can really kind of walk through what this decision means for them, versus just saying okay, okay, whatever, right, like there there's a distinction and it also look.
Tracy:let's say, with a cesarean, most people are going to feel a lot better if they've taken a few minutes and kind of walk through the brain process right, benefits, risks, alternatives, intuition, doing nothing, um, before they say yes or no Again, they may come to the exact same conclusion that yes, I'm going to go ahead and have this cesarean. But typically they're going to feel a lot better about it than if they just say yes without thinking it through.
Johnna:I love, I love all of that. So going back maybe to the beginning what are the qualification, certification, education that a doula must go through to like? Can anyone just do this?
Tracy:like I mean yeah, so there's no regulation in the doula world, so anyone could call themselves a doula all of the doulas on our team are certified um.
Tracy:I'm trying to think right now. I think all of us are currently certified um. Several of us have varying like. I have a lot of letters behind my name cause I've been certified through a lot of different organizations um over the years. But, um, you know, so there are a few doulas on our team who have multiple certifications from different organizations, but the one we all share in common is called pro doula. I used to train doulas through them as well, so I know their curriculum pretty intimately because I used to teach it Um, and a lot of what we've talked about with you know. Unbiased support is really heavily taught in that particular um training and certification. Um. The other great thing about that organization is that they also provide education through something called the doula learning channel, so doulas can go back pretty inexpensively and choose modules that are specific to what they're interested in or that they feel like they need more training in. So I actually have one on there.
Johnna:It's about perineal trauma that I created, so I'm one of the educators in that, in that too.
Tracy:So, um, there's kind of you know, the opportunity um to sort of support in a niche way, like if I know that I have um a family who is having multiples and they're going to be in the NICU, I might go and take those modules, because it's 45 minutes um to two hours depending on the course of in-depth, more training that you just don't get in.
Tracy:That original certified you get. You know it gets touched on, but a little bit more specific to that particular topic, and so that's. You know all of our doulas have that certification. We also in our agency do monthly um education opportunities. So, um, we have team meetings monthly and either I teach on a topic or we bring in a community expert, and so that's anything from. A couple of months ago we had um Dana stone. She does um infant sleep and adult sleep and she came in and did some more education about, you know, healthy sleep patterns and you know that type of thing. We've also had pelvic floor PTs come in and teach. So we do have kind of this continuing education. Is that required of doulas?
Johnna:No, it's not, they don't have to do anything.
Tracy:Like it's really interesting Like that's crazy, right, and that's why there is a very wide spectrum of um I don't know how to say this nicely um. There's a very wide spectrum um of doulas in professionalism, doulas who have good relationships with um providers and nursing staff and that type of thing because how does it work?
Johnna:Like I know some of the physicians I worked with, just even stepping in as a nurse practitioner, they're very guarded, they're very so how did they like relate to you, I guess, are they very receptive of doulas in the?
Tracy:hospital Some, not all. Okay, it was always my intention as a doula to be BFFs with everyone in the room. And part of that comes from, like this innate need for people to like me.
Johnna:People pleasing. I'm going to do a podcast on that. No, I have an energy healer for real. I'm going to do a podcast episode on people pleasing.
Tracy:Like for real. For real, it's a's a problem. We were gonna do like a five-part series. Yeah, yes, you should. It's good stuff because I mean, honestly, we all have it. Oh, and I feel like too, like for for me specifically, like I hate being in trouble, oh my god. Um, so I always kind of always went in with the intention that even if this person doesn't like me, it's not because it's not going to be because I was doing or saying something that was hurtful or intention right.
Johnna:I was always going to go in and talk to them and if they ignore me, then that's on them, Like that's that's their being a booger right Like well, just caveat, what you're going to hear in that podcast is kind of like I had to learn working with her. It's it really is the other person and what they're going through it has nothing to do with you. Their dog could have died that morning and they're just treating you you know.
Tracy:So I have learned again, like if you do this work long enough and I feel like this is true of L&D nurses, any kind of nursing, any kind of healthcare you do this stuff long enough and you're going to be traumatized by circumstances. I mean literally um and for doulas, it's maybe maybe you get that in the first few births, or maybe you're 10 years in or you know whatever, but it's going to happen.
Tracy:And for me, um, I started to have a lot of compassion for specifically obstetricians, Um, when I had a lot of really, really hard births that were odd circumstances, right, Like stuff that statistically just doesn't happen a lot, but kept happening to me or my clients kind of in a row, and there was one particular birth that I had that was so traumatic that it was just completely just rocked my world and I had to kind of step back and I had another doula fill in for me for a little bit.
Johnna:I was gonna ask you that, like we all know and like I think that society forgets how dangerous birthing is just because now we have hospitals and things where people can step in if there is an emergency.
Johnna:But I think that people truly do forget people literally 5060 years ago, were dying giving birth. Yeah, and I know I've had several friends that have either had stillbirths, you know, miscarriages or things like that. So how do you because if you're working with mom, let's say, from four weeks of pregnancy to this nine month delivery, how do you do that? How do you handle that trauma? And still like, let's say you that happened to you, but yet you have another lady tomorrow.
Tracy:Yeah, and so in the agency model it's great because we do have the partners right. So, like, if the lady is due tomorrow, the person or the client is due tomorrow, the other doula who she already has a relationship with in that team is going to attend. But me personally I did. I had to call somebody in because I was in such a raw spot. I did not believe I could support this person without fear, like, I was so scared and I also grew a lot of compassion for the providers, because I remember thinking they don't get to take tomorrow off, like they still have to go back into work, maybe tonight, and still have to do this thing.
Tracy:Um, that rocked my world, right, like, and so I think, um, those experiences, um, created a lot of compassion and empathy in my heart for providers, even the ones that are stinkers towards me, like, even the ones that pretend like I'm not in the room or they ignore me when I speak to them. I started viewing them with a lens of they are traumatized or they are hurt and I may represent something to them, because there is a wide range of doulas, right, I am always keenly aware that not everybody practices like me, but we all wear the same title and it's for some people. They can't separate that or they don't take the time to separate those things. Um, and so some of it is just this, this knowledge of like I still am going to try to be friendly, I'm still going to try to be, you know, kind and compassionate, but I'm also not going to take it personally anymore. I love that.
Johnna:I love that because I worked in ER for 11 years, and I like that you take that approach, because I wish I would have. I wish somebody would have taught that. So I love that you have this agency where you can teach other doulas, because we quickly forget how traumatizing it is, like you've seen traumatizing things and but yet you still have this positive attitude. And I think that can be two different ways, right, you could either stay traumatized and kind of hold this barrier where you don't have emotion, which is the way that I started being. Yeah, and I knew I had to take a step back. And my friends, like we would talk about it, like so I would walk into work and I would probably see two, three people die a day and it was nothing. It didn't seem to phase me, but I had turned that emotional part off, so much so that in my personal life, when something traumatic or emotional happened, I was just like and yeah.
Johnna:So, like I love that you can stay positive through that, because that's very hard to do If people I mean like if you're just out there listening and you've had someone pass away or you know you know how hard it is to get up the next day and go to work you have to do your job. That is your job Right, so I love that you do that. Now, do you have support system yourself?
Tracy:or how do you do it? I mean, I went to therapy.
Johnna:Yeah.
Tracy:I mean I went to therapy, yeah yeah, good for therapy. Yes, I have a pretty good support system and I mean at the time to like the one that I'm specifically talking about. There were five other ones leading up to that and which I did turn off my emotions, so I kind of identify in some way to that. I think mainly the differences is for doulas. We often do have a relationship with these people going in, so it's a little, a tiny bit different in the fact that, like you know, you're emotionally invested?
Johnna:we are. Yeah, we're where.
Tracy:I don't know the person yeah, um, but I think too, for people who do well in emergencies, there is a degree of turning that off in the moment and it's it's hard to remember to turn it back on Um, and so again, that's kind of coming from that place of compassion and understanding with providers is like if they don't have the knowledge even or the self-awareness that this is happening, um, they do kind of just become hard. And I remember talking with one of my friends who is a nurse practitioner at Huntsville Hospital and I was talking to her and kind of crying and it was not right after that birth it was a couple births later and I was just telling her how hard it was to kind of be back and not be scared and a provider came up and said, well, you can't get so emotionally attached to them or you'll never survive. And I kind of walked out of that feeling really sad for her but understanding like why she has to do that. But that's not what we do, Like that's kind of the opposite of what we do.
Johnna:You have to be emotionally involved and like.
Tracy:Our goal is like connection and like like well someone, you someone. The only way to get someone to trust you right is to emotionally connect right, right, and so we invest a lot of our emotions in um, into our client, um. So you know, we do have a little bit of a difference, because it's different, um, it's still always traumatic, but it's different to to have an emergency of a stranger versus someone that you right like one.
Tracy:One of the birds was a third time client of mine, um, and it was. I don't want to explain anything because it was really, really traumatic and I don't want to like accidentally traumatize someone but, like it was severe, like severe, severe.
Tracy:Didn't know she was gonna make it kind of thing. And it is very, very different to watch someone that you have known over the course of three pregnancies um, almost die right, uh, in front of you. And that wasn't even the one I'm talking about, like that was one of the previous five, yeah, and having a support system basically kind of. After that it was actually I think it was MC um in our church, like, um, I was sitting there and just kind of talking in a very monotone, like I had not cried about these birds yet, like I had not had any type of emotional reaction. Um, and someone was like basically called me out and was was like you are not responding in a way that is appropriate. Um, and they weren't doing it to be mean, they were just saying like right, they noticed something was different.
Tracy:It is not normal for for you to talk about these types of situations with no emotion, like yeah, um, and honestly'm very, very honest. What it took for me was I got in a minor car accident In a parking lot. I was fine, but I could not stop crying. I cried and cried, and cried, and cried and cried. And the police officer was like are you okay? And I was like no, it wasn't a car wreck. No, it wasn't the car wreck.
Johnna:It was like are you okay? And I was like no it wasn't the car wreck. No, it wasn't the car wreck, it was like the thing that opened well, like when, when I had a police officer tell me it was funny, a police officer tell me one time he was a friends with the nurse that I worked with and I was talking about how, like I didn't really have any emotion, but then I would watch a commercial about a dog or something and I would just right and I would just start crying.
Johnna:And he said, yeah, because that's your like, you're finally releasing all these other things. He's like you're not crying about the commercial. I was like, right gosh, yes, how did I not know that?
Tracy:yes, I was not crying about the car accident, it was really, really minor. Um, and then that that was when it kind of clicked with me that, like between my group at church, and then this kind of encounter, this accident, that, um, I needed to process, like I needed to have that um time spent processing this, yeah, um, I don't know why, I thought it wasn't worthy, like I thought that I could handle it, like I thought that I should be able to handle this.
Johnna:I think that's because that's what we're taught. Yeah, we're taught that you have to get up, you have to pick it up, you have to keep going, don't show your emotions, don't cry, don't be invested, don't be involved. It's just what we're told every day. Yes, so you think, if you're doing the opposite of that, that somehow you're different or right, like you said, not worthy, and that's not true, and I think that's. That goes back to another like whole topic, which is a whole, another different podcast, like where people don't talk about their emotions or they don't talk about going to therapy. I think it's getting there, but no one talks about. Like no, you don't have to go tell all your business, but like to share things with people. That makes you relatable and that makes people go. Oh, you are human, you are going through this. You do understand. I can empathize.
Tracy:Right and I feel like too, in healthcare, specifically like I don't want to traumatize anyone else. Right, like I don't want to traumatize anyone else, right, I don't want to tell them my stories and then them be traumatized because they're heavy, and I mean that's true of most of the medical community, and so there's even a very small group of people that you can even talk about that with other than a therapist, right, right, like I don't want to talk about these things with pregnant people or people who could get pregnant?
Tracy:Like right, or even people who may be pregnant in 10 years. I don't want them to remember these things. Yeah, um, and carry these with them, like you know. So I'm very selective about um, even who I speak about. You know my trauma with just because it's well.
Johnna:I mean, if I'm trying to have a baby and you tell me all these horrible things, I'm like should I, should I be doing?
Tracy:this Right Should I?
Johnna:be doing this.
Tracy:Right, and I do want to pause and say like these things that I saw were pretty, pretty rare.
Johnna:It's just, I have been to a lot of births, Well to flip the script like what is your some of the most rewarding, like happy client moments that, like you're just like this is like why I do what I do.
Tracy:Okay, so one of them specifically was actually after this, right after I took a break, because my sister-in-law was having a VBAC and the birth that I had kind of a rough situation with was a VBAC and, for those who don't know, it's vaginal birth after cesarean Cause again, I forget sometimes that people don't know that Um, and so my kind of the turning birth I'll say um, that was rough was also a vaginal birth after cesarean and I knew that I was going to my. I was invited to go to my sister-in-law's birth and I knew I had to kind of get my mind right because I was so scared for her Cause not only did we have an emotional attachment, she's like my sister, like right, I mean, I mean that's family.
Johnna:I love her.
Tracy:Um, and, but at her birth, um. So first of all, just kind of a brief, a brief synopsis Um, we really unsure. We're unsure when I needed to go they live in Florida, it's a 10 hour drive, um and so I I didn't know when I should go down um to be there for her birth. She had asked me to come down and be her doula, and so I had planned to fly in on um right at 38 weeks, which is when her water broke with her first baby, and my plane landed. My brother was supposed to come pick me up from the airport and about 10 minutes before he got there, he said run out of her water broke. I was like, oh, my gosh, but I'm here, like, yeah, come pick me up.
Tracy:And and so being invited into her space when we're not biological sisters, right, like she actually has three sisters, yeah, and so being invited into her space when we're not biological sisters right, like she actually has three sisters, um, and so being invited into her space number one, which is a huge honor, and then being able to witness the birth of my niece and being able to watch my sister-in-law, um, kind of do this really hard thing, right, like this super hard thing. She'd planned on getting epidural. She couldn't get it. It was too fast, and like watching her work through something that was just incredibly difficult and um but powerful was one of the best memories that I have, um, just being able to kind of be a part of that in my professional capacity.
Johnna:Right.
Tracy:Right, um, and so that that was probably one of them. And on the postpartum side, um, I had without getting too specific, I had a family who called me. Um, I don't typically do the shifts and births anymore because, um, as an aside, my health is sort of wonky and I have to keep a really strict sleep schedule, um, otherwise I will be really sick and in bed for a while. So, um, I don't typically do a lot of um, um overnights and type of things myself anymore. Our doulas do that.
Tracy:And this specific person called me and it was going to be a few days before our doula could go and start services and I just heard something in her voice and I thought you know what? Um, I will come tonight, like, if you need that support, I will come tonight. Um and I knocked on her front door at 9 30 PM and she answered the door and started sobbing and she just said I'm so exhausted, um, she had multiples, she hadn't slept for like four months. They were on the same schedule, um, and she was working and it was just I could.
Tracy:Her overwhelm and her fatigue were so palatable that, um, she was so relieved to have someone walk in her home to help her. Yeah, it forever kind of marked my brain of, like this is why we do this, like this is why is that we are supporting people, um, through this huge change, whether it's the actual birth process or the postpartum period, like this huge shift into a new reality. And it kind of goes back to the therapy and sometimes we need help, right, and sometimes we don't know who to ask or we wait a long time and so or we don't ask, or we don't ask because we're told that we're supposed to be able to do it all.
Tracy:Yes, that's yeah yes and um, just the relief that she had and she had told me in the morning, like I didn't actually, she said, you know, I still woke up a lot, she said, but I went right back to sleep because I knew you were there and so kind of just like she slept through the month. I mean, she didn't sleep through the night in months and months. Um, and I actually followed her same exact schedule. I, you know cause the first shift. We don't usually change anything.
Tracy:We just do exactly what the family is doing If one of their goals is to get more sleep when we're not there and, um, I slept 45 minutes, like that was all that, you know, yeah, and that's probably what she was doing, um, and so anyway, just the, the impact that we do have, um, you know, was again just in that particular instance, just really noticeable and and just rewarding, yeah, and just kind of like, uh, you know I was exhausted, but still it felt like, oh my gosh.
Johnna:I'm so glad I could help you. Yeah, and you and you gave some like to her, like, even though that was probably so minuscule, it was probably to her.
Johnna:She was like, oh my God, god, you just saved my life, you know like because it is rewarding whenever you're able to actually truly help someone in a way that doesn't require money, it doesn't require gifts, it's just like let me just actually truly support you. Yes, now flipping just a little bit to the business side, you said you've been a doula since 2008. When did you open the agency rocket city doulas? Oh, 2020, really, yeah, so three years during yes, oh, covid year was rough. I was gonna say how does that even work?
Tracy:it was not good.
Johnna:Well, I was gonna say with covid, most people in the hospital could have two people. One one for an entire year. So if they could only have one, were you that one. Sometimes, wow, so some. So someone was like sorry, honey, sorry, you're not witnessing the birth of your child.
Tracy:It's gonna be a repeat client who was like, uh, and actually I attended that birth, because she was like, if I have to choose, I'm gonna choose tracy, I love it um.
Johnna:So most like sorry, honey, you're not doing anything but holding my hand anyway.
Tracy:Um, most first-time parents were choosing their spouse or their, their partner, um, but people had used this before.
Johnna:Um definitely were probably picking us um girl is brave though, to start a business during covid, so I started it in january, though I didn't know okay um.
Tracy:So in 2019 I actually spent most of 2019 prepping to open um. In 2019, I switched to the shared model of call so I brought on another doula to me specifically and I wanted to make sure that shared call did all the things that I was hoping it to do. Yeah, so previously, just as a really very quick thing, I was on call continuously because I was super, super busy and so there was never a time I wasn't on call. So if I wanted to go on vacation, I want to do anything with my family, it needed to be like tomorrow, because my client gave birth yesterday, or it needs to be 10 months from now when I don't have any clients, and then I would have to take about six weeks off Because you don't know when they could come.
Johnna:Two weeks early could come to the site like you know well that goes back to why doctors do try to push for scheduling, because they never have a life outside of birthing.
Tracy:Right. So I kind of wanted to see how does shared call work? Will it work for us? Is it going to do the things I hope it's going to do? Does it allow us to go on call, you know, from the get go, those types of things? So in 2019, I did work with somebody else I brought on to kind of run that model just to make sure it was sustainable and it was going to work, um and so. But I launched the official agency in January of 2020. Um, covid was in March.
Tracy:Uh, we did not go to um many hospital births from um, basically March to March, almost a whole year okay we did have a couple of folks who switched to a home birth because by then midwife assisted home births were legal in Alabama starting in the fall of 2019.
Tracy:Just to keep people out of the hospital, yeah, so a couple of people switched to that. A couple of people switched hospitals. So at Vanderbilt we had to, like you know, submit our credentials and things and then we could be an additional support person. There was a little hospital in Tennessee we could go to, so there are a couple of hospitals near ish that some people swap to. We had to learn how to do virtual support, which sucked like oh my gosh, like is it better than nothing? And this is kind of what we had to walk away with. Yeah, you know, when I would talk to my dealers, it's like they'd be like I hate virtual support, it's so hard. Um, it is, it's really, really hard. But at the time we had to kind of look at it like okay, but are they still getting more support than if we were not doing virtual?
Johnna:support and the answer is yes, they were well, now you have a plan if something ever happens in the future. You now have a plan.
Tracy:We absolutely do. Um, but honestly, what kind of saved the agency in terms of let's talk like finances was postpartum support, because we didn't start postpartum support until September of 2020. But a lot of times our doula was the only person allowed in that person's house, and so that's kind of what saved us that year. Yeah, we took a lot of hits, we refunded a lot of people money, and opening a business requires quite a hefty amount of money.
Johnna:It does Because they say you don't start making money till what? The second or third year yeah, so I think my business like grossed $2,000 in 2020. Now is this something that insurance will help cover.
Tracy:So mostly no, mostly no. Um, there are some states in which medicaid will cover uh, labor, um, and the medicaid coverage overall typically is really crappy like it is not enough that I, as a doula, would even probably do it right it does. It's not even worth it because you might get 20 reimbursement, right, yeah, I know, like some places it's like 600, which is just not enough, and they also require like a lot of visits too, which is just a system like not sustainable for people.
Tracy:Do you take insurance? Um no, we don't. Um so Medicaid in Alabama doesn't cover it yet. Um, there are some things like I know there's a couple of like MediShare type companies that will cover doula support, in which we will um work with them, with someone's health savings account yes, health savings accounts do. Okay, some people will have to have a specific invoice, but I'm happy to write whatever they need for health savings.
Johnna:That's so.
Tracy:That's good to know, though yeah, they can, and we also offer payment plans, particularly for labor. Um, postpartum is a little bit trickier, just because we do invoice every week for the work that's been completed. But for labor, if you hire us early you have a good chunk of time and we do do payment plans too. So you know there's lots of opportunities to work with people's budget in that so that they can get the support that they'd like while still kind of supporting, because the other the flip side is is? Um, part of my goal has always been to create sustainability within the doula community. Most doulas only work two to three years before they burn out and part of the shared call model is part of that was designed to create sustainability so that doulas can go on vacation and they can go to a doctor and you know all those turn off their phone for an hour or whatever um.
Tracy:But the other part um was to you know again that the sustainability also has to do with finances. Um, a lot of support services sometimes most of the time they are women support services, yeah, are kind of viewed as if we should be doing it for free, right. But if we want to create um long-term um, folks who are experienced, have knowledge. You know like a lot of people want a doula who has experience.
Tracy:Well, you know, with the lifespan of two, when I say lifespan, their, their work span, yeah, of one to two years, three years maybe yeah it's not very much right, like you don't have that many doulas who do it for a really long time, um, and if that's what we're looking for, if we're looking for seasoned growth you know people who have education then we need to set up the system in which they can do that without sacrificing their body, their family, you know, their income.
Johnna:I agree. I agree. No, this has been so informative. I'm so glad you came on to the podcast. I know our schedules are so crazy.
Tracy:I mean obviously if you're out delivering babies.
Johnna:Your schedules are great, but tell everyone how to follow you. Find you, hire you. Where can they go?
Tracy:Yeah, so we are. Our website online is wwwrocketcitydoulascom, and then our Instagram handle is at Rocket City, doulas, and our TikTok is Rocket City.
Tracy:Doulas, our Facebook is Rocket City Doulas, and they can. The easiest way to actually hire us is to go on our website and click the contact us button Okay, and they can fill out an intake form and schedule a call directly with me and then we'll chat and we'll get them set up with a doula team that fits what they're looking for Because all of our doula teams kind of have different vibes and make sure that they're a good fit, and then they'll reach out and kind of go from there.
Johnna:All right, guys, if you were in the Huntsville area. You can find all of this in the show notes or just play it back and listen. Go follow Rocket City Doulas on Instagram, facebook and TikTok. And until next time, guys, thank you.
